So we needed Moiraine...[spoiler]

Discussion in 'Wheel of Time Discussion - Books 1-14' started by Paladin Brewer, Jan 14, 2013.

  1. Ty al'Djinn

    Ty al'Djinn Mod for Life Gaidin Company Commander of San d'ma Shadar Forum Moderator

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    Moiraine's entire life was spent behind the scenes, She has gambled with entire countries and many lives, including her own. She worked with no acknowledgment or reward, and never expected any of either. She found Rand and the others, protected them, and guided them. She became a central figure in their lives - someone they trusted, loved, and valued.

    Moiraine took out Lanfear. Moiraine discovered the Amyrlin. Moiraine's return was not only a banner for all, she is an expert on the prophecies and politics. She was wholly responsible for the Dragon's Peace actually working, bolstered the Amyrlin's resolve when it was most needed, and helped fight against the Dark One himself.

    Moiraine was, through the vast majority of the series, a bond between the main characters from Emond's Field- a wholly unifying force. She gave Nynaeve Lan, and exerted influence in countless ways even while trapped. And because of her return, the Last Battle was won.

    Anyone who thinks her return was unimportant, unnecessary, or lackluster needs to read AMoL again.
     
    Last edited: Jan 16, 2013
  2. Morvath al'Aeren

    Morvath al'Aeren

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    I agree that it was an issue of trust. He certainly wasn't going to link with Cadsuane! and Both Elayne and Avi (who he trusted) were busy doing other things.

    I'm not sure...in Avi's vision in Rhuidean, the flaw in the Dragon's Peace seemed to be with the Aiel being left out, not with Moiraine being absent at the meeting. Though to be fair, she *could've* been at the meeting that resulted in the alternate future in which Aiel became extinct, as the book doesn't mention Moiraine while Avi is in Rhiudean.

    "If I'm remembering correctly, Moiraine also kind of set Egwene straight on the whole breaking the seals idea. Telling her that it needed to be done and as the Watcher of the Seals she would be the one to do it."

    Ooohhhh, that's a good point!
     
  3. Morvath al'Aeren

    Morvath al'Aeren

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    This does make a lot of sense. I'm going with this!
     
  4. Goldfive

    Goldfive

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    I've never been on this forums before because I wanted to read the series for myself without speculation of other people... But right now I have a lot of questions (just finished the last book, gives a hollow feeling realising it is over...)

    But regarding Moiraine: what are the questions she asked to the Aelfinn & Eelfinn? At the end of book 13 Mat asks her that, and she says: 'I'll tell you later' or something like that. But she never got the chance... Or have I just missed it?

    About Moiraine: she must have had some information regarding Callandor. Before book 14, Rand didn't know he could channel the True Power through it. In AMOL, he mentions it, but without further explanation. He could've thought of that before. And what about Min? At some page Rand says that he and Min made up some kind of plan... But again, without further explanation.

    The book was awesome, but I think Jordan & Sanderson didn't want it to end. I think that's why they put so many things in it for us to think about. For example: the 'voice' of the creator at entrance of the Pit of Doom, and Rand saying he has heard that before. WHERE!? I honestly can't remember.. Perhaps re-read the whole series again. If I have time...
     
  5. Lenore Carvoe

    Lenore Carvoe Aes Sedai

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    Rand heard the Creator's voice for the first time when he fought at the Eye of the World and cut Ba'alzamon from the Dark One. There was this scene where Rand saw Tarwin's Gap and ended the fight with his Earth powers. "This must have an end", or something similar he said, and then the Creator answered "The end is not here".
     
    Last edited: Jun 2, 2013
  6. Goldfive

    Goldfive

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    Hmm, I should look that up. Pity that I've lend the first 4 books to someone else... Well, thanks for the answer :)
     
  7. lyssiekins

    lyssiekins

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    I'm happy that she came back a bit humbled, a bit more human, before this part I was unable to relate to Moiraine as a real person. Once I found out she had weaknesses, and loves, and would be a real normal person, it made her much easier to like. Not to mention her role in the last battle was simply to get him there. Thats why she was searching for him in the first place. She fulfilled her own personal prophesies and she was a truested friend of Rand and that her and Nynaeve had mended ways made it all the better. I'm happy with how he ended her story.
     
  8. Mattrim al'Korin

    Mattrim al'Korin Soldier

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    I agree with both Axis m'Troutilas and Asandra al'Terra. Moiraine brought calm reason to the meeting when tension, attitudes, and selfish ambition had reached a crescendo and everyone was ready to abandon diplomacy. She also fulfilled her purpose and mission by guiding Rand to fulfill the prophecies using all her abilities, not by seeking power.
     
  9. rmmateus

    rmmateus

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    I have to agree that it was Moiraine who made the alliance between nations possible, she was the one who convinced everyone to break the seals. Still, Moiraine was powerful enough (with her angreal) and, side by side with Nynaeve, they wielded an unimaginable amount of saidar that was necessary to the sealing of the Dark One.
     
  10. Jodea Kegan

    Jodea Kegan Aes Sedai

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    I disliked her return. She was never my favorite character, but her death scene was one of the best parts of the entire series and one of the few times Jordan killed off a main character.

    Then she was brought back and she seemed sappy and weak. I preferred the old Moiraine. She was annoying, but at least she wasn't a simpering wussy
     
  11. Gendry_Goldeneyes

    Gendry_Goldeneyes

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    see for me its more like

    all the other characters grew up and came into themselves while Moraine was gone, so when she came back, her Badassery was shadowed by all the other Badasses we had now with Rand, Mat, Perrin, Nyenve, Egwene, etc.

    in honest it was a nice contrast to her all powerful self in the first few books especially with original thoughts about Aes Sedai
     
  12. Brandegoris Al'Mor

    Brandegoris Al'Mor Citizen

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    I think it was just because Moraine is RAD. :) Period. End of story... :) The Author just did it for himself because he loves that crazy Aes Sedai!! <3
     
  13. Jas'yn Al'Dragoran

    Jas'yn Al'Dragoran Gaidin

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    Fantasy authors should be forbidden from resurrecting their dead heroes....
     
  14. Brandegoris Al'Mor

    Brandegoris Al'Mor Citizen

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    But but...Gandalf..... :(
     
  15. Wilin Stoneriver

    Wilin Stoneriver Soldier

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    I never actually believed Moiraine was dead.

    Aside from the treaty, I always felt that Rand needed both her and Nynaeve at Shayol Ghul with him, since those were the only two Aes Sedai that he really, truly trusted to follow him.
     
  16. Mattrim al'Korin

    Mattrim al'Korin Soldier

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    There needed to be someone there with influence with all of them and the understanding of the prophecies to bring everything together. Of course she wasn't perfect, as we see in New Spring and her original manipulating of Rand, but that's her instinct as a Cairhienin noblewoman and Aes Sedai all rolled into one.
     
  17. Almira ni'Caldazare

    Almira ni'Caldazare Citizen

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    Lews Therin could not seal away the Dark One properly because the female aes sedai refused to help. Moiraine convinced the aes sedai to help. She made it possible to seal the Dark One away.
     
  18. The Gambler Matrim

    The Gambler Matrim

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    Couldn't agree more! She was the glue that held that meeting together.
    I loved when she told Egwene that Rand wasn't going to break the seals because she(Egwene) was! Priceless!
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2019
  19. Brian Mandragon

    Brian Mandragon Recruit

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    When Moiraine when out of the picture Rand in particular was forced into a living hell as he learned the full extent of his conflict him the Dark One and seemly endless problems try to get the people he was trying to save to help themselves without any to turn to for advice. In the end he was pushed so hard that he changed himself into what he had to be to succeed. Moiraine's "death" also helped to keep her from being a target so she could be around to do what no one else had the faith to do. And as you stated it also forced the other to find their positions. Moiraine even with her power chose a path of playing a supporting role and the weave used her to achieve the seemingly impossible.
     
  20. Tobias Carawin

    Tobias Carawin Citizen

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    The WoT is a story about balance in many ways. Moiraine is the counterbalance to Rand. This position was somewhat adopted by Cadsuane for a time. Without either of their guidence, Rand would have never made it to the last battle.
    The other reason why Moiraine is so important is the amount of information she provides to the reader. Her character gives us the knowledge of the world as we get deeper into the series.