S2E8 "What Was Meant To Be" -- w/ Book Spoilers

[Boreas Silverfir]

This is the one that was nagging at the back of my brain but I couldn't quite put my finger on it. Moiraine is SO dedicated to Rand (which to her, sometimes means controlling him, but I digress). Rand has to save the world. No Rand, no world. That means a threat to her, her Warder, her fellow Aes Sedai, everything. So if protecting Rand means using the power as a weapon, I think she could (and probably already has) convinced herself that defending him IS the last defense of her life.

The books have a moment that really illustrates this and makes my list of most amusing moments.

During the battle of the Two Rivers either Allana or Verin isn't tossing fireballs at Trollocs. When Perrin confronts them about it she emphasizes that she didn't feel in danger until, right, this, moment.,

Edit to remove the pocket mess 😂

 

[Liesandra ar’Moor]

Moiraine is dedicated to Rand but I don’t think she wants to control him. It’s more like she wants to guide him so that he does what he has to do to save the world. He’s young and clueless mostly
Siuan definitely wanted to control him and would have caged him.
As for the 3rd oath, the one power is used against armies attacking all the time. She has used it to kill trollocs cause they attacked the village.

 

[Boreas Silverfir]

But at what point does one feel danger? That's the amusing part of the story moment from "Shadows Rising" I shared. The two rivers is being attacked by a veritable horde of trollocs and fades which should be enough for anyone to feel in danger. But to illustrate a point, the Aes Sedai in question let the trollocs army travel near an additional 100 paces closer to the defenders over the course of the conversation with Perrin.

 

[Liesandra ar’Moor]

But at what point does one feel danger? That's the amusing part of the story moment from "Shadows Rising" I shared. The two rivers is being attacked by a veritable horde of trollocs and fades which should be enough for anyone to feel in danger. But to illustrate a point, the Aes Sedai in question let the trollocs army travel near an additional 100 paces closer to the defenders over the course of the conversation with Perrin.

 

[Liesandra ar’Moor]

I understand what you are saying. What is real danger and what’s not? But there is no doubt once they start attacking. And you’re right she had no idea who was on those ships.

 

[Satara al'Caelahn]

That's one of the biggest loopholes with all three Oaths. They're all about how the Aes Sedai in question interprets them.

If two Aes Sedai are standing in front of an attacking army, one might attack that army before the other because she feels herself to be in danger sooner.

In regards to the Oath to speak no word that is not true, we see that with Moiraine in season 1 when she's talking to the Whitecloaks and then later explains it to Egwene. She said she was meeting a sister because "All Aes Sedai are my sisters." Another Aes Sedai who didn't feel that way wouldn't have been able to say that.

It's all subjective based on each individual person and how they perceive the Oaths and their own reality.

I imagine that if an Aes Sedai wants to get around and Oath, there's a lot of mental gymnastics involved.

 

[Boreas Silverfir]

The truth you think you hear may not be what was said.

 

[Liesandra ar’Moor]

The truth you think you hear may not be what was said.

Aren’t they actually lies of omission

 

[Boreas Silverfir]

To quote a great Male Aes Sedai "what I told you was true, from a certain point of view"

Spoiler: Hello there

 

[Megana Vallentin]

My mind being blown because I just realized Jedi and Sedai are such similar sounds and those comparisons could really be a deep rabbit hole for me.

 

[Boreas Silverfir]

My mind being blown because I just realized Jedi and Sedai are such similar sounds and those comparisons could really be a deep rabbit hole for me.

If we really want to dig into it I think we'll need to start a new spoiler thread 🤣🤣

 

[Liesandra ar’Moor]

If we really want to dig into it I think we'll need to start a new spoiler thread 🤣🤣

Oooooh when was the first book written?

 

[Liesandra ar’Moor]

I checked first book was 1990
First Star Wars movie was 1977
Powerful men vs powerful women
The force vs the one source

 

[Megana Vallentin]

THE FORCE VS THE ONE SOURCE ALSO RHYMES

What deep philosophical discourse? I'm just here for the words that sound the same.

 

[Sorcha Al'Verdan]

lol, there is also some correlation between the midichlorian's being tied to the very fabric of existence and the saidar / saidin fueled wheel of time weaving existence

 

[Aduiavas Ida]

And that the ability to channel is genetic. You either can channel, or you can't. (Or you can learn, but then, technically, you can.)

No amount of wishing for it would make a person able to channel, if they weren't born with the ability.

 

[Linkelivar Miou'Mai]

That finale was...wow. Very satisfying to me.

Things I loved/enjoyed:
- Mat/the Gambler ended up a Hero of the Horn!!! It's very well deserved, and it's nice that Mat got his due at the very end of the season!
- Moiraine-Lan bonding scene. An absolutely gorgeous scene
- Rand being proclaimed the Dragon. Sure, there may not have been the Banner of the Dragon, but the fire dragon proclaiming him made up for that. I wonder if the fire dragon and Rand were seen elsewhere in the world, just like Rand's fight with Ishamael was seen all over in the books
- Whitecloaks vs Seanchan. Whitecloaks vs Perrin. We don't otherwise really get much of this in the books (nor does this play out exactly like the books), but this was done well, and the inclusion of the Whitecloaks in the battle in Falme really helped capture the chaos of the moment we read about in the books
- Moghedien vs Lanfear. Lanfear vs Ishamael. I seem to recall in the books the relationship of the Forsaken to each other as being such that they were basically "squabbling amongst themselves". This really seemed to take shape and I loved it. Can't wait to see the final list of everyone released and how the Forsaken will meddle with the world. Hoping for more Lanfear-Moghedien antics, especially because the two are both so adept at Tel'aran'rhiod

Things I wish I saw in the finale:
- Birgitte. I know she was referenced in S1, so I'm a little disappointed we didn't get a good look at Birgitte when the Horn was blown
- Fight between Rand & Ishamael. While a sky battle might have been cool, I would have loved to have seen Rand and Ishamael fight sword on staff on top of the tower
- Rand vs Turak. Rand's strength at this part of the series is his swordfighting ability, and we don't really get to see this on display
- Min (where are you Min!)

Very curious how Rand's wound is going to be the same or different than in the series, given the initial wound is from something tied to Shadar Logoth and Mashadar rather than the Dark One/the Shadow

Gosh I can't wait for Season 3!

Brigitte is there when Mat blows the Horn. I'm sure we'll see more of her next season (possibly in the Wolf Dream)

 

[Leala ni al'Dareis t'al'Caleum]

Tv show Moghedien is so everything i wish she had been in the books. A creepy, unsettling spider.

 

[Linkelivar Miou'Mai]

I agree, she was my favorite Forsaken in the books and something tells me people are going to see why.