Ruslan's Reread: Narg & Other thoughts

[Ruslan Rynar]

So I got Mister Mancandy to start the series and figured it was a great time to do a reread. So we're both currently listening to the Eye of the World. I'm loving the experience and sharing this series with him. Now, to just get him to join.

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I'm about 12 chapters in and noticing things I never did the first time...

• Narg talking was no big deal and happened so quickly that I didn't even remember it as being unique. This time, I was like... THAT'S MY BLIGHTED BROTHER!!
• Rand very clearly channeling to help Bela. The description is just so clear.
• When did Nyneave leave the Two Rivers? Did I miss this? I swear she wasn't part of the group... but I might have dozed off for a bit. 😅

I'm also realizing that I reread later books or parts of them but never reread any of the first seven books. So I'm curious to see what else I notice.

 

[Ruslan Rynar]

In the first four books, there is A LOT of each guy thinking about how the other two are better with girls/women, which is SOOO annoying!

 

[Toral Delvar]

The description is clear, and we see his sickness a few days later in Baerlon, plus in hindsight, the other times he channels are also really obvious
Nynaeve tells us when that she left pretty soon after they did. This is also the start of the relationship between Lan and Nynaeve. He seems genuinely surprised for the first time since Rand met him, that Nynaeve was able to follow them, even though he tried to hide it.

 

[Phen al'Rohan]

I so like Lan's surprise at Nynaeve tracking him 🥰

 

[Toral Delvar]

And that she blushes when he complements her, which probably surprises Rand even more than Lan's reaction

 

[Phen al'Rohan]

And that she blushes when he complements her, which probably surprises Rand even more than Lan's reaction

🥰 🥰 🥰
As well it should! I can imagine how surprised she might feel herself, in this unusual position for her.

 

[Ruslan Rynar]

On Towers of Midnight, something Elyane thought just bothered me- and I can't tell if it is Sanderson messing up or if she really is just that stupid. She considers how much easier it would be to kill the upstart lord from the West. And I'm sitting here like you want to kill the childhood friend of the father of your children for defending his home when the Andoran crown couldn't be bothered to do its job for GENERATIONS? I get that it is a royal response, but still, can we try TRY not to be so damn stupid?

 

[Alexr al'Petros]

And I'm sitting here like you want to kill the childhood friend of the father of your children for defending his home

I'm not sure she knows "who" the upstart Lord is at the time of this musing.

 

[Ruslan Rynar]

I'm not sure she knows "who" the upstart Lord is at the time of this musing.

She knows he’s from the Two Rivers and grew up with Rand. The whole scene just shows how much she has to learn. She might have figured out how to get the throne but lacks the understanding that just because a map says an area is ruled by a country doesn’t mean anything unless you actually do the work.

 

[Alexr al'Petros]

lacks the understanding that just because a map says an area is ruled by a country doesn’t mean anything unless you actually do the work.

I agree with this. But I don't think she has any idea about his relationship to Rand only that he is from the same area as Rand. I wonder if she even asked Rand if he might be aware of any upstart Lord in Two Rivers, whether Rand would be able to piece together that she was speaking of Perrin? I doubt he would. He might probably think it was a Coplin or something. It's a great example of operating with very scarce unreliable information in a dynamic environment something that I suspect RJ was familiar given his Vietnam war background.

 

[Phen al'Rohan]

It's a great example of operating with very scarce unreliable information in a dynamic environment something that I suspect RJ was familiar given his Vietnam war background.

Never considered it that way before, but it makes a lot of sense, and it gives me a new angle to consider during our re-read!
Thanks for sharing this insight, @Alexr al'Petros

 

[Ruslan Rynar]

It's a great example of operating with very scarce unreliable information in a dynamic environment...

It is. I just expected more from the character. She talks about how she wants to protect Andor and that the people are Andor. Yet, when given a chance to demonstrate that commitment, she must be guided to a good decision. She is prone to leaping to a conclusion and then not changing her mind, regardless of the evidence. Her safety during her pregnancy is a perfect example. Just because the babes will be fine, she assumes she will be despite no evidence supporting that conclusion.

 

[Alexr al'Petros]

She is prone to leaping to a conclusion and then not changing her mind, regardless of the evidence.

Absolutely!! I love this assessment. It is one of the most frustrating things about her character for me!!

 

[Toral Delvar]

On Towers of Midnight, something Elyane thought just bothered me- and I can't tell if it is Sanderson messing up or if she really is just that stupid. She considers how much easier it would be to kill the upstart lord from the West. And I'm sitting here like you want to kill the childhood friend of the father of your children for defending his home when the Andoran crown couldn't be bothered to do its job for GENERATIONS? I get that it is a royal response, but still, can we try TRY not to be so damn stupid?

I think that's pretty in character for Elayne. The more power she gets, the more entitled and like a standard noble she gets

 

[Toral Delvar]

She is prone to leaping to a conclusion and then not changing her mind, regardless of the evidence.

she assumes she will be despite no evidence supporting that conclusion.

I think that is a big theme in the series - acting on insufficient evidence, or jumping to unwarranted conclusions. Sometimes it's unavoidable, as not acting isn't an option, so they just have to do what they can on the available evidence and hope for the best. Other times, it's just a character assuming they know better than everyone else, so their first thought has to be the truth
It's one of the things we try and track in the Chapter Summaries

 

[Ruslan Rynar]

I think that's pretty in character for Elayne. The more power she gets, the more entitled and like a standard noble she gets

You're right. I think I was craving character growth.

 

[Elanda Tonil]

Spoiler: Book spoilers

That scene turned me into an anti-Andoran. Two Rivers Independence or bust! I have a hard time believing the Two Rivers folk are going to be interested in paying taxes to a monarchy that straight up ignored them while they were invaded by tropics twice, and by whitecloaks. The only reason she remembers they exist now is because they’re exercising their free will and trying to strengthen themselves so they won’t be so vulnerable. Imo, Andor can go back to minding their own business and live with the consequences of the choices they’ve made these past few hundred years.

In my head canon, that’s exactly what happens. She sends tax collectors. They present them with a bill itemizing everything and everyone they’ve lost over the years without proper protection from the throne. She takes one look at the bill and decides to cut her losses and call it a day. And thus the kingdom of Aybara is established.

 

[Ruslan Rynar]

Spoiler: Book spoilers

That scene turned me into an anti-Andoran. Two Rivers Independence or bust! I have a hard time believing the Two Rivers folk are going to be interested in paying taxes to a monarchy that straight up ignored them while they were invaded by tropics twice, and by whitecloaks. The only reason she remembers they exist now is because they’re exercising their free will and trying to strengthen themselves so they won’t be so vulnerable. Imo, Andor can go back to minding their own business and live with the consequences of the choices they’ve made these past few hundred years.

In my head canon, that’s exactly what happens. She sends tax collectors. They present them with a bill itemizing everything and everyone they’ve lost over the years without proper protection from the throne. She takes one look at the bill and decides to cut her losses and call it a day. And thus the kingdom of Aybara is established.

I like your headcanon!

 

[Nimeroni Quilana]

I also look at it that its good the characters are shown as human, and getting to see inside their head what they think vs what they say and do, well it shows a very human way of being.

We dont alway control our thoughts, we do tend to fall on habits of thought patterns, its what we do about it, taking time to figure out if our mind is right where it goes and so on that shows our ability too grow, to change our way of handling things.

I dont remember the details and all of that scene, but think its important to keep in mind that it's part of good stuff in book that the characters not flawless, that their want to change or grow or be good doesn't suddenly make them the best at it or experts, as all humans they struggle with the environment that are around them and influenced them growing up, shaped their brain and whatnot...that just make them realistic humans.

Elayne always had a temper, and been rammed with flares of her upbringing in politics thats its own beast, and the way that its learned to think in rulers by traditions in many ways...if she didn't have these kind of thoughts in the context of it all, thats what in many ways would be unbelievable.

 

[Elrond Iluvlatar]

I think that with the whole thing of Perrin-married-Faile-who’s-going-to-be-queen-but-Perrin’s-a-lord-which-could-cause-the-Two-Rivers-to-become-a-part-of-Saldaea, Elyane is just doing what she was raised to do: keep control of Andor.