effects of using the one power

[Jas'yn Al'Dragoran]

I'm perplexed why different communities of women who channel seem to be effected by the one power differently. The obvious contrast is between Aes Sedai who take on the famous agelessness and the Kinswomen who live far longer but show signs of ageing. I'm not sure that the Windfinders or Seanchan show any particular signs of thier use of the one power on thier age yet. Any theories or thoughts on this?

 

[Bryce al'Mara]

The only real difference between the Kin and Aes Sedai are the oaths. So its pretty fair to say the agelessness is caused by taking the Oaths on the Oath rod. As the old Aes Sedai did not swear on the Oath Rods and as you can see the Chosen also do not have the agelessness.

 

[Jas'yn Al'Dragoran]

Ah yes they do mention the Oaths in terms of shortening life, but I never quite put that together that it would also cause the agelessness. But it makes sense. Also come to think of it those who are stilled are both freed from the oaths and lose thier agelessness, so they are obviously connected.

 

[Axis m'Troutilas]

The Oath Rods were originally intended to bind criminals against recommitting their crimes in the Age of Legends.

Criminals who had this binding put upon them multiple times (i.e. serious criminals) produced the ageless look to serve as a warning to those around them. It's slightly unclear if the shortening the life is a deliberate intention of the binding as punishment, or if its a side effect of the process.

 

[Toral Delvar]

When Sammael asks Graendal if the Ayyaad also bind themselves like criminals, he thinks there is no particular reason she should know about the binding

Plainly she had not reasoned it out; there was no reason she should. Few people in their time had ever committed one violent crime, let alone more. Before the Bore, at least.

ie that if there were more people bound, there would be more chance of people working it out, which implies that there is some sign, but that is pretty tenuous.

 

[Gedhan Audax]

I always thought that the kin didn't become ageless because they avoided using the power. Also the Damane and Windfinders are ageless and they aren't bound by the rod. I'm sure that the effect of the rod is to shorten life that is lengthened by channelling, think of the older Kin or Alivia.

 

[Jas'yn Al'Dragoran]

I was wondering about that Gedhan Gaidin, but others such as the Sea Folk Windfinders or Aeil Wise Ones don't seem to have any special agelessness and I don't recall any mention of them being especially long lived. If it is just the Oath Rod, why is there no mention of the Wise Ones for instance living many centuries. Soreila is often referred to as very old, but I don't recall it being mentioned as exceptional in the way it is with the Kin.

I was also wondering about the fact that those who are stilled like Siuan and Leanne lose the agelessness apparently instantly, presumably as they aren't bound by the oaths any more. But, those who are freed of the oaths on the oath rod don't seem to lose agelessness (though granted most retake oaths in short order).

 

[Kallaes Doon]

I was wondering about that Gedhan Gaidin, but others such as the Sea Folk Windfinders or Aeil Wise Ones don't seem to have any special agelessness and I don't recall any mention of them being especially long lived. If it is just the Oath Rod, why is there no mention of the Wise Ones for instance living many centuries. Soreila is often referred to as very old, but I don't recall it being mentioned as exceptional in the way it is with the Kin.

Sorilea is also very weak in the One Power.

Concerning Amys:

“You will tell us when you are ready,” Amys said complacently. She looked of an age with Melaine despite hair white as Bair’s tumbling to her waist—her hair had begun turning when she was little older than Egwene—but she was the leader among the three, not Bair. For the first time, Egwene wondered just how old she was. Not a question you asked a Wise One, any more than an Aes Sedai.

A Crown of Swords Chapter 10

Melaine:

The last of the four, a handsome woman with golden-red hair, no more than ten or fifteen years older than Egwene, hesitated. “It must be done,” she said finally, and unwillingly. “I answer yes.”

The Shadow Rising Chapter 23

On the other hand, Amys is strong yet never, that I can recall, described as appearing to be old. Rather, we are constantly told that her hair was already white when she was a child. The color of her hair is always highlighted as being at odds with the rest of her appearance.

So if Egwene is 18 to 20, Melaine, and be extension Amys, appearing 10 to 15 years older would look to be late 20s to early or mid 30s.

We can do a little more estimation concerning Amys' age as she was among the Far Daies Mai that found Tigraine in the desert.

“You knew my mother,” he said. Egwene leaned forward, as intent as he, and Mat shook his head.

Amys’s hand paused on his face. “I knew her.”

“Tell me about her. Please.”

She shifted her attention to the slash above his ear; if a frown could have Healed, he would not have needed her ointment. Finally she said, “Shaiel’s story, as I know it, begins when I was still Far Dareis Mai, more than a year before I gave up the spear. A number of us had ranged almost to the Dragonwall together. One day we saw a woman, a golden-haired young wetlander, in silks, with packhorses and a fine mare to ride. A man we would have killed, of course, but she had no weapon beyond a simple knife at her belt. Some wanted to run her back to the Dragonwall naked . . . ” Egwene blinked; she seemed continually surprised at how hard the Aiel were. Amys continued without pause. “ . . . she seemed to be searching determinedly for something. Curious, we followed, day by day, without letting her see. Her horses died, her food ran out, her water, but she did not turn back. She stumbled on afoot, until finally she fell and could not rise. We decided to give her water, and ask her story. She was near death, and it was a full day before she could speak.”

The Shadow Rising Chapter 34.

Since we know that "Shaiel" is Tigraine, we can determine that this encounter occurred about 4 years prior to the Aiel War. I can't recall where, but I seem to remember Amys once mentioning that she fought becoming a Wise One as long as she could, so I suspect she was probably around the same age as Aviendha when she started her training. Probably in her mid-teens when she met Rand's mother. Add another 25 or so years to get to the current time and you have someone who is pushing 40 yet looks like late 20s or early to middle 30s. To me, being described as 10 or more years younger than says must be sounds like she’s showing signs of slowing due to her ability with the One Power.

 

[Toral Delvar]

I always thought that the kin didn't become ageless because they avoided using the power. Also the Damane and Windfinders are ageless and they aren't bound by the rod. I'm sure that the effect of the rod is to shorten life that is lengthened by channelling, think of the older Kin or Alivia.

You mean aren't?

 

[Tazren Talamar]

The Wise Ones and Damane aren't ageless. It's mentioned somewhere that Egwene think Amys looks somewhat like an Aes Sedai, but the agelessness isn't mentioned explicitly - and it might very well be the white hair spooking her.

I was wondering about that Gedhan Gaidin, but others such as the Sea Folk Windfinders or Aeil Wise Ones don't seem to have any special agelessness and I don't recall any mention of them being especially long lived. If it is just the Oath Rod, why is there no mention of the Wise Ones for instance living many centuries. Soreila is often referred to as very old, but I don't recall it being mentioned as exceptional in the way it is with the Kin.

At one point, either Sorilea or Amys mentions an Aiel Wise One who was extremely old (300 years or something, I think), iirc correctly. I don't have the books to quote right now, though.

That aside, Aiel live in a very inhospitable environment. There are dangerous animals everywhere, the desert is a treacherous terrain to live in ... it's not strange at all that they don't live as long as Aes Sedai, who live relatively luxurious lives.

I was also wondering about the fact that those who are stilled like Siuan and Leanne lose the agelessness apparently instantly, presumably as they aren't bound by the oaths any more. But, those who are freed of the oaths on the oath rod don't seem to lose agelessness (though granted most retake oaths in short order).

But it's never mentioned that they those who are stilled lose their agelessness instantly, though. Siuan and Leane weren't mentioned to have lost it until after having been imprisoned; same goes for Amico. Those who removed the oaths always reswore them very quickly, so there wouldn't have been time to the agelessness to disappear.

 

[Toral Delvar]

But it's never mentioned that they those who are stilled lose their agelessness instantly, though. Siuan and Leane weren't mentioned to have lost it until after having been imprisoned; same goes for Amico..

Though it is also mentioned that Amico didn't have it in the first place, so a little confusion there.

 

[Tazren Talamar]

[quote="Tazren Talamar":2glzu768]But it's never mentioned that they those who are stilled lose their agelessness instantly, though. Siuan and Leane weren't mentioned to have lost it until after having been imprisoned; same goes for Amico..

Though it is also mentioned that Amico didn't have it in the first place, so a little confusion there.[/quote:2glzu768]

Ah, yes, this is true. Amico is far too young to actually have gained the agelessness in the first place, if she really was just four years older than Egwene and Elayne. I really didn't think of that.

That was a fairly minor point, though.

 

[Dal al' Ecfugusun]

I was also wondering about the fact that those who are stilled like Siuan and Leanne lose the agelessness apparently instantly, presumably as they aren't bound by the oaths any more. But, those who are freed of the oaths on the oath rod don't seem to lose agelessness (though granted most retake oaths in short order).

But it's never mentioned that they those who are stilled lose their agelessness instantly, though. Siuan and Leane weren't mentioned to have lost it until after having been imprisoned; same goes for Amico. Those who removed the oaths always reswore them very quickly, so there wouldn't have been time to the agelessness to disappear.

It's actually specifically mentioned when Min sees Siuan and Leanne that normally the agelessness takes much longer to wear off and that it probably happened so soon in their case due to their rough treatment, ie being tortured (presumably with the ter'angreal in the tower basement, though this isn't specified).

 

[Emerald ní Róhan]

What I want to know is how the Black Ajah members managed to retain the ageless appearance. They clearly have been unbound by at least the first oath, and by demonstration, the oath against using the Power as a weapon. Should we assume that, when someone becomes new to the Black perhaps there is a secret ceremony involving the Oath Rod that allows the to forswear the AS oaths and the swear their new oaths to the Dark One?

 

[Bryce al'Mara]

While they are released from their AS oaths they are required to take Oaths to the DO. Its not the fact that the oaths are the Aes Sedai oaths that give them the ageless look its the oaths in general.

 

[Emerald ní Róhan]

That is what I would generally think. I believe the assumption was that the "ageless" look is being linked to making oaths on the binding rod. So I'm just kind of figuring the Black Ajah secretly uses the Oath Rod.

 

[Bryce al'Mara]

or another Binding rod the oath Rod is not the only binding rod. I wish we knew a little more about the whole process.

 

[Emerald ní Róhan]

Agreed.

 

[driedraspberry]

The first Ariel we meet in the Great Hunt mentions Verin to have the look of the wise ones. I dunno, I assumed he meant agelessness.

 

[Emerald ní Róhan]

I think you're on the right track, there. If I remember correctly he says they are similar. I think Egwene ends up thinking about this as well, when she goes to study with them.