Tolkien References in WoT

Discussion in 'Wheel of Time Discussion - Books 1-14' started by Narysse a'Jahar, May 8, 2016.

  1. Narysse a'Jahar

    Narysse a'Jahar Aes Sedai

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    I know this has been done to death, but I'm rereading and just came across some very clever references to Tolkien in EOTW, chapter 9:

    "But all of those folks thought of themselves as the people of the Mountain Home, the people of Manetheren.

    "Their King was Aemon al Caar al Thorin, and Eldrene ay Ellan ay Carlan was his Queen. Aemon, a man so fearless that the greatest compliment for courage any could give, even among his enemies, was to sy a man had Aemon's heart..."

    So since Aemon al Caar al Thorin is one of the major figures in Two Rivers history.......does al Thorin = al'Thor? And in that case, is Rand himself a reference to Thorin Oakenshield of The Hobbit?

    :cheese
     
  2. Maibella ni Rhoiden t'al'Varrak

    Maibella ni Rhoiden t'al'Varrak Aes Sedai TVT Editor Forum Moderator

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    Ooh, I never noticed that! I tend to gloss over names in the historical parts of the books. :cheese
     
  3. Terez

    Terez

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    Noobquestion: Is it standard practice to put spoiler tags on everything from the books, even in the forum which includes AMOL discussion?

    This might be stating the obvious, but I think both are ultimately a reference to Thor. That's part of what makes it difficult to sort out the Tolkien references; in a lot of cases they're drawing inspiration from the same sources.

    Incidentally, Cauthon is probably a mashup of Caar and Thorin.
     
  4. Almira ni'Caldazare

    Almira ni'Caldazare Citizen

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    I have noticed more references to Norse mythology and Arthurian Legend.
    Tolkien had references to Norse and Arthurian myths too so they do overlap !! :D
     
  5. Morrighan Daghdera

    Morrighan Daghdera Aes Sedai

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    This is an exceptional article comparing RJ to Tolkien. I had the absolute pleasure of seeing Mr. Livingston's presentation on this topic at 10th Anni. It was captivating.
     
  6. Almira ni'Caldazare

    Almira ni'Caldazare Citizen

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    I see similarities between the Aelfinn and Eelfinn and Shakespeare's Mid Summer Night's Dream.
     
  7. Jasper al'Belere

    Jasper al'Belere

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    First off, thank you to so much to Morrighan Sedai for that fascinating article.
    Next, I will list a few similarites I have noticed that may be obvious to many.
    *spoilers* (I don't know how to enclose it) *spoilers*
    At the beginning of the Eye of the Worldit is easy to see the comparison of The Two Rivers to Hobbiton, as it is an area that is extremely peaceful and laid back. There is also the case of the Myrddraal in the first few books, especially Eye of the Worldbeing very similar to the Nazgul in The Fellowship of the Ring, as they are figures whose faces cannot be seen yet, wearing night-black capes which are not affected by the wind, they are as silent as the wind as they ride, they ride black horses, and they are hunting down certain young men (or a certain hobbit).
    Later on in the Eye of the World, there is another large comparison between the dagger from Shadar Logoth and the Ring of Power. Both are kept by a main character, corrupt the main character, and leave lasting corruption.
    *spoilers end*
    Will post more when I have more time, and with quotes!:D
     
  8. Al'Amar El'Haldir

    Al'Amar El'Haldir Citizen

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    For spoilers, hit the (go advanced) button. The spoiler tag is the very last one in the 2nd row.

    Your link between Nazgul and Fades is pretty interesting. I never thought of them that way before. But the similarities are there! The Dagger and One Ring are slightly different where Sauron's ring is the focus of the story; whereas the dagger is a minor plot in WoT.

    Hobbiton and the Two Rivers are similar; but you've got me thinking of Two Rivers people with hairy feet :lol
     
  9. Falone Charpontier

    Falone Charpontier Novice

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    Nice catch!
     
  10. Jaedan Edhel

    Jaedan Edhel

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    Confession: I felt EotW was such a close copy of LotR that I just thought 'meh' and didn't intend to read the rest of the series until a friend I trusted recommended me to carry on.

    But there are dozens of little things in there, a few off the top of my head:
    'Galad' (well, 'Calad', but the C mutates into a G for proper nouns) means 'light' in Elven (Galadriel, Gil-Galad)
    Matrim/Perrin = Merry/Pippin
    Myrddraal - the description is very close to the Black Riders
    'The Nine Rings' is one of the Inns mentioned - "Nine [rings] for mortal men, doomed to die..."

    I have a list, somewhere...
     
  11. Alyccea Nymaessene

    Alyccea Nymaessene Aes Sedai

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    Of course, al-Lan Mandragoran sounds rather similar to Aragorn... and his story is quite similar, too.
    Trollocs are Orcs, and Ogier seem to have similar demeanours to Ents.
    Even the idea of a "dragon" could be considered a Tolkien reference - though, like "Thorin", it's a reference that goes back well before Tolkien's time.

    Morrighan, that's a fascinating article! Thank you for sharing it!
     
  12. Devonna Harren

    Devonna Harren Citizen

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    I've only ever been pointed at the Arthurian legend aspects, but I do remember catching the Trolloc/Orcs and Ogier/Ents. These are all super interesting, but I think the Fade/Nazgul and Dagger/Ring aspects are super interesting. I did at one point wonder if they would have to destroy the dagger and how.

    which left me quite confused and disappointed to be honest. Still have no idea what really happened, think the dagger might be it's own entity similar to the ring however (Separate from both Mordeth and Mashadar)