The Wheel of Time Re-read (currently reading - Lord of Chaos)

Toral Delvar

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I've actually added details to the notes sections for many of the chapters so far, based on what we observed/discussed.
 

Merena Orithana

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@Hal Bahalla Yes - all those points, especially the rushed endings and the Forsaken being able to find Rand so easily.

I think RJ really came into his own as a writer after book 3, really. That is when we see things make more sense. Though Rand's women really don't make any more sense throughout. I get Avi and then Min, but Elayne??? o_O
There are plenty of other tall red-heads for you to choose from. :rofl

@Toral Delvar Gaidin - I was looking at the EoTW chapters in the library earlier and trying to beef them up too! I will have to take another look at the subsequent ones here soon. :love
 

Ilverin Matriam

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I am now also done with the Great Hunt. Several things about the ending I haven't considered before:
- Rand didn't even meet Fain in Falme
- In previous reads I had imagined the Heroes of the Horn made out of mist and transparent, sort of like Aragorn's army in the Return of the King, but Rand sees them in color, so they must look like people
- What is the Horn of Valere and how does it call the dead Heroes? When is it created?
- The people from the Age of Legends (the Forsaken) know of the Horn. It seems to be a legend even in that Age,.... though the Aes Sedai put it in the Eye of the World, which would also mean that it was readily available to the Aes Sedai of that age :scratch But still... Lanfear as Selene sounded genuine in wanting to see it in the earlier chapters.
- How many of the Heroes are actually bound to the Horn in the time of the Age of Legends? Do the Aes Sedai from AoL know who Arthur Hawkwing even is?
- Also it's interesting (or maybe not) that all of the important Heroes are not reborn around the time of the Last battle in the end of the Third age, but are waiting for the horn to call them, I guess. For example, Arthur hawkwing might have gotten reborn as one of the ta'veren, but I guess his main purpose is to... well be Arthur Hawkwing :laugh:
 

Hal Bahalla

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How many of the Heroes are actually bound to the Horn in the time of the Age of Legends? Do the Aes Sedai from AoL know who Arthur Hawkwing even is?

I’d think they are always bound to the horn, through all ages. But who they are most remembered as would depend on the most impactful previous life relevant to the Age. In the Third Age Hawkwing’s empire building and assault on Tarvalon are what he is remembered for. In the Age of Legends he might be remembered as a different name.

Birgitte talks about having lived lifes under different names… or I am mostly sure she does…
 

Toral Delvar

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Birgitte has had many lives, as has Gaidal - it seems they are always linked, though it is possible they were not. We know of a few lives of hers. Her life as Jethari Moondancer seems to have been forgotten apart from as the Elmiara and the Shadoweyes story. And maybe half a dozen lives between the formation of the White Tower and the Trolloc wars (and one during the formation)
For the others, we don't know - many we know from the Hunt for the horn, which seems to be set during the Trolloc Wars, but did any have other lives? Did any of them have a life after the War of the Hundred Years?
 

Ilverin Matriam

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Exactly, I thought that because Birgitte and Gaidal have lived many lives being reborn as other people, that the other Heroes also get this, but I guess we have no confirmation for it :scratch
For example, Lews Therin should only be reborn once, as the Dragon Reborn, he probably doesn't get reborn in the time between the Breaking and the end of the Third Age, since... it doesn't make sense.
But I guess until he is reborn, Lews Therin is also bound to the Horn, and that is how the others know him :cheeseeni:
 

Toral Delvar

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Well, Artur also says he has fought alongside LTT many times, and against him, but these could have been from before the Age of Legends. We also know Gaidal (and I think Birgitte) have been spun out - if they have the same adventures, with the bow and braid, wouldn't people realise who they are? Elayne certainly should.
One of the interesting things (to me) about Rand, is that his story has so many Arturian conventions - well, the names of people around him at least (Thom, Egwene, Nynaeve, Moiraine/Morgase) and the Sword in the Stone
 

Hal Bahalla

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My impression has always been that LTT had been reborn many times, and lived many lives before Rand. But there are a number of "things" that have to be aligned for the path to lead to the last battle. If something goes "awry" then the pattern eventually spins him back out for another go.

Imagine if Tam hadn't heard him crying on the slope and infant Rand died? It would have been another one of those "I win again" versions of Rand's life he saw in the Portal Stone adventure.
 

Jaryd Kosari

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I always assumed that comment was a reference to the fact that the Wheel turns eternally. If the Heroes can remember their past lives before they are reborn into a human form, then Artur would, in that instance, totally know that he and the Dragon have fought with and against each other many times in the past, even if the Dragon's soul is ONLY reborn as LTT and Rand with each turning.
 

Aduiavas Ida

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I think Rand has a moment when he is almost succumbs on Dragonmount in book 12 when he remember many past lives...
 

Merena Orithana

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How many of the Heroes are actually bound to the Horn in the time of the Age of Legends? Do the Aes Sedai from AoL know who Arthur Hawkwing even is?

Yes - that is pretty odd - but maybe they knew him under a different name? Also - it seems like Heroes are always bound to the horn, but then in AMoL, another Hero is bound to the horn (Jaim). Does that mean that he was always bound to the Horn and was just spun out as Jaim in the present time?

Well, Artur also says he has fought alongside LTT many times, and against him, but these could have been from before the Age of Legends.

This sounds strangely reminiscent of Ishamael's comments. Maybe RJ just didn't have that backstory pinned down yet at this point in the books? Ishy I can understand, because he constantly lies. However, I can't explain this away as easily... odd.
 

Toral Delvar

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I somehow doubt it was a gholam, especially not THE gholam we see later. The Soulless are first mentioned in the beginning of the Dragon Reborn and later Egwene and Nynaeve find on in the White Tower. I believe they were meant to be introduced then.
But the man who shot the arrow was probably a gray man - Ingtar mentions his eyes just slid off him. We often see something hinted at or mentioned that doesn't become significant for several books
 

Hal Bahalla

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Getting a jump start on The Dragon Reborn and the Prophecy but at the start states

“And his paths shall be many, and who shall know his name, for he shall be born among us many times, in many guises, as he has been and ever will be, time without end.”

This reads like LTT is most definitely bound to the wheel and spins out often. I suppose it could still be just twice (once to open and seal the bore, and then again to repair it), but it doesn’t read that way to me.

“His paths shall be many” - sounds like far more than just the two times…
 
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Finished Great Hunt earlier today! I thought I was behind but apparently I got ahead somewhere... :scratch
How I didn't get that Ingtar was a Darkfriend on the first read through I'll never know. Or that Lanfear was Selene. I'm going to blame that on being 12. I'm going to blame a lot of stuff on being 12 during this re-read. :cheeseeni:
Will be starting Dragon Reborn tonight.
 

Ilverin Matriam

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Right on time Laralelle :laugh:

I sped listened to the Dragon Reborn and now I will read it slowly during our scheduled re-read. Can't wait!

I posted the schedule for book 3 in my first post, we will start officially on Monday Aug 23rd. I will also update the signature for those of you who wish to use it :D
 

Merena Orithana

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:ha
 

Toral Delvar

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And the last two
Chapter 49
Nynaeve apparently did some Healing on Rand without realizing it
What was Moiraine doing around Falme – it never comes up, so probably not anything important
Moiraine states she didn’t send Verin
Even Moiraine still thinks Ba’alzamon is the Dark One. Really, one of them should have worked it out by now
Moiraine states the Black Ajah has revealed itself – is this warding the Drakhar or Liandrin?
Masema sems to almost worship Rand - this will cause trouble
Chapter 50
Just repeating that people talk about Rand
 

Hal Bahalla

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What was Moiraine doing around Falme – it never comes up,

Didn’t Moiraine and Lan head towards Falme when they left the sisters because Toman Head had “come up” in 2 or 3 different places. But mentioned that it would take them mo tha to get there because they didnt use the Ways or another shortcut method?
 

Toral Delvar

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She did, but when she met Rand, he says he didn't know she was there and she mentions how she was around, doing things, and that she wasn't able to rescue the captured Aes Sedai. She probably had no way of Finding him, but it seems she wasn't just sitting there hiding
 

Toral Delvar

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I think in general, I liked the first book more. We still had the same sort of quest narrative, which we get again in book 3 (off to the Stone) and to a lesser extent in book 4, but after that, although the books always come to an exciting conclusion, things get a lot more political. I did like that we got to see even more prophecy
 
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