Slightly controversial thread about Rand

Amylia Lerato

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Look, I absolutely love almost every character in the books, I'm up to book 4. Elayne is my absolute favourite, followed closely by Perrin. But, generally I love all of them. Except Rand. Rand seems to whine a lot and it seems like he keeps sticking his head in the sand and being oblivious to everyone around him. I am really trying to like him, considering he's quite important, but I can't help desperatly wanting to punch him in the face every time he turns up. Any Rand lovers able to tell me about his redeeming qualities so I can stop despising him so much?
 

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I think almost everybody has at least one character they consider rather punchable. (Mine is Gawyn. :rofl: ) Rand is definitely a wool-head through the first several books in a lot of ways, and sometimes he's a jerk...though I think you could make that argument about various of the characters at different times. They're all flawed, all very human.

As for Rand specifically... While I'll not really defend him or try to explain away everything he does, I'll suggest that it can be worthwhile, in my opinion, to read him as a young person who doesn't want to do what he's doing, and who is ultimately scared of his destiny but trying to do his best despite how scared he is. I think if I had suddenly had some big, awful destiny tossed my way when I was his age, I would have been scared witless. Heck, I still would be now.

Where you're at, at the end of TDR and into the start of TSR, he's finally had to own up to being the Dragon Reborn, because he couldn't have drawn Callandor if he wasn't. And then there's all the rest of what happened in the previous two books. He's been trying to escape his fate, deny his destiny, but the Dark One, the Pattern, and pretty much the whole world won't let him. Everybody seems to think they know best what he needs to do, and they're going to tell him how to best live his life...and/or manipulate him. Or, worse, they might want to kill him or gentle him or force him to serve the Shadow. At this point in the series, I read Rand as a young man who is scared of what he will become, unsure how to go about doing what he has to do (since there's nobody on hand to teach him), and worried about almost everyone around him trying to manipulate or sabotage him. So he's trying to stay a step ahead of them all and not let himself get hurt, deceived, or captured. Yet at his heart, his still a young person, and he lacks experience and patience. In the absence of reliable mentors, when faced with crises and problems, he makes rash, impulsive, and sometimes downright stupid choices...though if we were to ask him, he'd probably tell us he's doing the best he can.

By the time Rand draws Callandor, he has grown a lot from the boy on the Quarry Road at the start of EotW, and he'll grow a lot more before the end of the series. We really do see him grow up as the books go on.

I'm sure others will chime in with their thoughts, too, and you certainly don't have to accept what I say at face value. It's just my opinion on it, and you might very well have spotted something I missed!
 

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Paging @Nadezhda al'Lanahrin to defend your cinnamon roll :look:

For myself - I was never a huge Rand fan either. There are other characters who annoy me more, though. I think Rand gets handed the short end of the stick a bit - like, what would you do if you were a sheepherder from the middle of nowhere who's told "you're the dragon reborn, the most awaited and feared person in the world, oh and you'll probably go insane"? You'd probably do at least a bit of complaining and trying to pretend none of it was happening, too. The best I can really suggest at the point you're at is to keep reading. I think he gets better from here. He's a character with a lot of growth, that's for sure.

Edit: and of course Vik beats me to it with a way more eloquent response. :laugh:
 

Nadezhda al'Lanahrin

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I will return to this thread when I’m less busy, but yes, Rand is my cinnamon roll. But specifically Josha Rand.
 

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When I first read WoT, I hated Rand so much that I skipped some of his chapters. :look: Years later, I reread it and he was one of my favorite characters. :laugh:: I think Rand grew on me because I became more interested in RJ’s depiction of trauma and mental illness. I liked that RJ really dig into how unpleasant it would be to be in his position. And, by the end of the series, I really felt that Rand worked through his stuff and evolved as a character. My favorite line of dialogue from the entire series is a Rand quote near the end. I guess I’d just say, be patient and maybe many books from now he’ll win you over—or maybe not! Luckily there are lots of other characters to enjoy haha
 

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I like Rand. He manages to maintain a sense of humor (mostly), despite being under incredible pressure and having a bare handful of people he can trust who aren’t trying to manipulate him for their own means.
Oh, and of the characters from the first four books, Elayne is my least favorite
 

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I love Rand! He's precious.

Okay, so let me explain. He never bugged me, not even when he was being an idiot.

Look at it this way: Here's a young guy from a really isolated village who's got a couple decent friends and a crush on a girl. He grew up hearing horror stories about the Forsaken and how they'd slice him up in his sleep if he didn't eat his vegetables. And worse, he heard about the dreaded Dragon who caused the Breaking of the World, the most horrible, world-altering, apocalypse-level tragedy in living memory. He was feared and hated even more than the Forsaken. The Dragon was on par with the Dark One according to most tales.

Now as the story progresses, Rand's being manipulated by an Aes Sedai, has been attacked and watched his village struggle, has been ripped away from his home pretty much without his choice, and in the middle of fighting for his life and the lives of his friends, finds out that he can channel the One Power. So now he knows that his destiny is to go insane and hurt and/or murder everyone that he cares about most in the world. He knows that the taint on the power is going to rip away his mind and his choices, that it will alter his very identity and his perception of reality in the most dangerous of ways.

OR... he'll be gentled, which is the equivalent to a Dementor's Kiss. He'll no longer have the will to live, as though his soul has been ripped out of his body. It's a death sentence. And knowing that he can channel means that those are essentially his only two options.

After being told that he's the Dragon Reborn, that's a whole different weight on his shoulders.

At that point, Rand has literally just been told that he is the most feared and hated man in all of history. The most dangerous. So while being hated and feared, he's going to go insane, and oh by the way, he also has to save the world or everyone is going to die. Bonus prophecy points, he's going to break the world again whether he wants to or not, when all he wants is a quiet life in the Two Rivers.

Of COURSE he acts the way that he does. He's just a kid who got ripped away from his home and has been manipulated, hunted, attacked, and told what to do since the very beginning. He's scared and he doesn't know what to do or who to trust, and that's before the taint on the power starts to affect him.

I will protect him at all costs. :laugh:
 

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...and this discussion is why I love TVN.
 

Arella Mathara

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I'm also a Rand fan. Yes, he whines and has some dumb views on things but nobody's perfect. I'm too tired to write more now, and scared I'll spoil things, but will try to write more when I have more time/energy
 

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Thanks so much Rand lovers. I'm glad that he's a little less annoying now that he's drawn callandor and (at least a little bit) accepted what's going on. I think part of me is worried about Elayne, so maybe he'll improve once it's obvious he isn't going to hurt her.
 

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I think Rand's concern about hurting the people he cares about drives quite a few of his decisions.

If you're inclined to share, what concerns do you have about Elayne, and how do those shape your perceptions of Rand?
 

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Personally I remember how she really liked him at the beginning and I was quite worried he was going to break her heart without even realizing it. I felt as though he was so oblivious to everything going on around him, whilst wanting to protect people he would unknowingly hurt them. Min seemed like an example of that. I spent most of book three worried that Elayne was going to try and save Rand and he would accidently pull her into the sort of scenario where she would get hurt. I'm trying to think about Rand a little more like the teenager whose learning how not to accidently kill his friends now, rather than an absolute woolhead who doesn't even try to see the consequences of his actions. He's definitely starting to grow on me
 

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I was just revisiting the chapter where they meet for the first time this afternoon, and they're pretty adorable. :)

You had mentioned how Elayne is your favorite. What about her in particular do you like most, if you don't mind sharing?
 

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I love how she strives to change anything she is unhappy with without complaining. She seems to embody the phrase "change what you can't accept accept what you can't change". It's one of my pet peeves when characters spend the entire book complaining about their circumstances without actually changing them. (I know Rand was dealt a little more difficult hand), but I love her approach to problem-solving.
 

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I think every character gets annoying in certain parts, but that's something I've always admired about Elayne. She's a snobby princess, but she does what she thinks is right to the best of her ability and she does it with her head held high. Very much a natural leader.
 

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I think every character gets annoying in certain parts, but that's something I've always admired about Elayne. She's a snobby princess, but she does what she thinks is right to the best of her ability and she does it with her head held high. Very much a natural leader.
Ditto this! She absolutely develops into her own woman with her own goals, separate but tangential to Rand's objectives, and that's what made me start to like her in the end.

I think Rand is, and will always remain, a wool-headed sheepherder, but the external and internal battles he faces does make him a little more endearing.
 

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Absolutely. He's definitely gotten a heap better now he's accepting his destiny rather than fighting it
 

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I love how she strives to change anything she is unhappy with without complaining. She seems to embody the phrase "change what you can't accept accept what you can't change". It's one of my pet peeves when characters spend the entire book complaining about their circumstances without actually changing them. (I know Rand was dealt a little more difficult hand), but I love her approach to problem-solving.

That's definitely one of Elayne's positive qualities! I also think she has a little bit of an advantage in some aspects of the problems the characters confront, especially where politics are concerned, because she was literally raised and trained from childhood to face those kinds of challenges. She's also at a disadvantage in other areas because she's been sheltered, so she is ignorant of experiences some of the other characters have had growing up. So in that regard, I think she's pretty well balanced.

One thing I really loved back in the day and still love is how the girls go about saving themselves at the end of The Great Hunt. :)
 

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Absolutely. I remember reading the chapters where they talked about Rand going to rescue them and I was so glad he never even got the chance. It's one of my favourite parts of the wheel of time series, how all the women are represented as not only 3 dimensional characters but ones who aren't just there for the purpose of needing a love interest. I've been burned before with fantasy books who abandoned character development for the female protagonists the moment they get a boyfriend.
 
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