Seanchan Omens

Discussion in 'Wheel of Time Discussion - Books 1-14' started by Elania al'Manir, Oct 8, 2019.

  1. Elania al'Manir

    Elania al'Manir Aes Sedai Forum Moderator

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    The Seanchan believe in omens, signs from nature that help read the Pattern and fate. Are these real? We see examples of omens coming true, but Mat also thinks about a time when an omen was false and Tuon claimed Selucia must have counted the ants wrong (I just read that in either Crossroads of Twilight or Knife of Dreams I think).

    The westlanders think omens are ridiculous, but the Seanchan think things like ta'veren are fake and we know for a fact as readers that they're not. Is this an example of knowledge that the Seanchan have and Mat similarly thinks are fake, or are they really just superstitions?
     
  2. Leala al'Dareis

    Leala al'Dareis First Seasoner Aes Sedai Head of the White Ajah

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    I think they're real. At some point, they encounter Min and find out about her abilities and understand even the symbols and images she doesn't understand. They call her their Doom Seer and hang on her every word. Even though Min finds it infuriating, I find it fascinating. It's an ancient practice handed down generation to generation that left the main lands when Hawkwing's armies were driven out.

    I just think it's cool. :lol
     
  3. Thaddius al'Guy

    Thaddius al'Guy That Guy Aes Sedai Forum Moderator Mafia Admin

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    I always loved the phrase "Doom Seer"
     
  4. Leala al'Dareis

    Leala al'Dareis First Seasoner Aes Sedai Head of the White Ajah

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    Just makes it that much cooler. :giggle
     
  5. Thaddius al'Guy

    Thaddius al'Guy That Guy Aes Sedai Forum Moderator Mafia Admin

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    I think westerners think its fake due to a lot of that stuff coming across as threats to children from their parents when they are younger. "If you don't go to bed, Lanfear will get you" sort of thing, (Though I can't remember if that was a real thing or not in the books). As a result of thing, most people grow up thinking they are not real because their parents used lies to get them to do whatever they want. Trollocs? Our parents parents made it up to get us to do chores, etc.
     
  6. Leala al'Dareis

    Leala al'Dareis First Seasoner Aes Sedai Head of the White Ajah

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    Agreed. I think it's also lumped together with the One Power and other misconceptions about the Pattern and such.
     
  7. Marcus

    Marcus

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    I think you nailed the biggest clue that RJ gave us that there is some definite truth to the omens. We as readers know that Min's visions are true. The fact that the Seanchan are able to accurately interpret her visions show the knowledge is viable.
     
  8. Toral Delvar

    Toral Delvar Archivist Gaidin

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  9. Elglas Comarin

    Elglas Comarin

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    So I've always taken this as a cart before the horse issue. We know that the Seanchan Empire has had previous Doomseers and they presumably knew what some of their viewings meant, and were presumably made public. My theory is that the omens only mean something when they come from someone with that particular talent, but in the absence of those with the ability (which is presumably very rare) it evolved into superstitions similar to horoscopes irl.