Rand's dying and living again - Balefire?

Discussion in 'Wheel of Time Discussion - Books 1-14' started by lance.veristrem, Oct 12, 2010.

  1. I'd say the most simple explanation for Rand dying and living again at TG is the use of balefire. If the DO's minions were to see Rand die, then presumably they're stop trying to kill him, and after some quick balefire, Rand is back and no one is trying to kill him or find him, or stop him in any way because they'd all think he's dead. Plus the time spent dead might give him some important insight into the pattern or even the DO.
     
  2. Felix Eselta

    Felix Eselta

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    It may work.
    But it may cause the pattern to unravel if a thread as big as Rand's (with him being Ta'veren and all and his role in the LB).
     
  3. Unless it were all part of the pattern. I mean, if I'm right, then this has been foretold and prophesied and therefore part of the patterns plan.
     
  4. Kallaes Doon

    Kallaes Doon

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    I don't see how. Balefire doesn't really have a place in the Pattern. If the Wheel could plan around and for the use of Balefire its usage shouldn't have the repercussions it does.
     
  5. Shienara M'asynde

    Shienara M'asynde

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    Plus the fact that though balefire might be able to bring him back if he were killed, balefire does not actually erase time, so it's the 'Twice dawns the day' part of the prophecy that I'm curious about....
     
  6. Kallaes Doon

    Kallaes Doon

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    I've always figured the "twice dawns the day" was referring to some form of false dawn. Until the Choedan Kal were destroyed I thought they'd play into it as the they were described as glowing like the sun when used. At the right time and observed from the correct location, they had the potential to lighten the horizon as if dawn was approaching. A serious explosion or fire could conceivably have a similar result.
     
  7. Ivanor Winshaw

    Ivanor Winshaw Gaidin Conference Coordinator

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    My "To live you must die" theory was that in the LB, Rand would be killed and then when the Horn of Valere was sounded, we would see Rand as the Dragon thread called back.
     
  8. Keisha al'Benn

    Keisha al'Benn Aes Sedai

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    I remember reading somewhere that Nynaeve wouldn't be happy until she had healed someone who had been three days dead....I always wondered if that was some foreshadowing to the main event.
     
  9. Kallaes Doon

    Kallaes Doon

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    I very much doubt it and strongly believe that to simply be a figure of speach. Nynaeve successfully healing a dead person is a violation of previously established concepts. The main concept is that, when the body dies, the soul departs. She would need the Dark One's ability to snag a soul during the brief window of opportunity where doing so is possible. Otherwise, if Nynaeve should heal the body and bring it back to life, it would be a soulless abomination. We saw a little of what it would be like when Rand tried healing the little girl in the Stone and Moiraine was begging him to stop.
     
  10. I always wondered about that as well. Kallaes' view does make sense though and I think I have to agree with him on that.
     
  11. Elagabalus

    Elagabalus Guest

    It always seemed that the neatest way to come to a happy ending would be to have the Dragon's soul split into two parts - the Lews Therin half and the Rand half. Then the Lews Therin half could die while the Rand half could continue on. I don't see how this is accomplished - there seems to be no foreshadowing of a means to this end. It just seems to be the easiest way to end the narrative on a happy note - and who says things must end happy?
     
  12. Kallaes Doon

    Kallaes Doon

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    If I recall correctly, Jordan has stated that a soul cannot be split.
     
  13. Liiane al'Rhuidea

    Liiane al'Rhuidea

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    He has.

    Elagabalus, the Lews Therin personality is already gone, anyways.
     
  14. Kira Lisande

    Kira Lisande Guest

    "twice dawns the day"

    somes kind of eclipse-ular phenomenon?

    silly, i know
     
  15. Areandara Zukari'th

    Areandara Zukari'th

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    Eclipse= 2x Breaking dawn :lol
     
  16. Azi al'Thone

    Azi al'Thone Gaidin

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    I very much doubt it and strongly believe that to simply be a figure of speach. Nynaeve successfully healing a dead person is a violation of previously established concepts. The main concept is that, when the body dies, the soul departs. She would need the Dark One's ability to snag a soul during the brief window of opportunity where doing so is possible. Otherwise, if Nynaeve should heal the body and bring it back to life, it would be a soulless abomination. We saw a little of what it would be like when Rand tried healing the little girl in the Stone and Moiraine was begging him to stop.[/quote:30eia39t]

    I see your point, but I get the same feeling from it to. The concept of rebirth after 3 days is a very strong one, especially with Rand's tie to the Messiah in Christian faith. And it is fantasy, so who knows? :lol
     
  17. Bukkwild

    Bukkwild Citizen

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    heres one way out there for you...Rand dies, goes to tel'aran whatever... and either gets ripped out of there or somehow affects the course of events from there.

    Just a way out there theorum
     
  18. Bryce al'Mara

    Bryce al'Mara

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    That idea is quite popular. Im just not fond of the idea of being able to bring someone back to life which is why if anything Im hoping for the body switch. I bet it will probably be the TAR method though.
     
  19. Bukkwild

    Bukkwild Citizen

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    TAR method, must have missed that somewhere...anyone care to explain? is that short for tel'aran'rhiod ?
     
  20. Bryce al'Mara

    Bryce al'Mara

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    Yeah its short. Its a popular theory that Nynaeve will go into TAR and pull Rand out similar to when Birgitte got tore out.