Discussion in 'Non-WOT - Literature and Fiction' started by Toral Delvar, Aug 20, 2012.
Romeo and Juliet or Twilight. Both of equally horrid.
Seriously? You consider the quality of Twilight and Romeo and Juliet to be the same?
Yes, because they both in my opinion to suck horribly.
LOL! I can see that Romeo and Juliet is a masterpiece.. LOL BUT I will definitely agree that whether Shakespeare was a genius or not , his works are not generally very fun to read. ( I.E. SUCK)
Well, the majority of his popular works weren't meant to be read. And while I can understand thinking that R&J is overrated, putting Shakespeare on the same level as Stephenie Meyer is a little drastic.
The thing is I just think Romeo and Juliet is overrated, I said nothing about his other works, which I do enjoy. In fact Taming of the Shrew, Midsummer's Night Dream and Much Ado About Nothing are easily my favorites from Shakespeare.
Yes comparing Twilight and R&J is easy. Romeo is at least in his 20's. And Juliet was 12? At the most 14? And how old is Edward compared to Bella? Creepy no?
I agree... Romeo and Juliet is no romance, and neither is Twilight.
Yeah, Romeo and Juliet isn't very well written, the balance between comedy and tragedy is completely off.
It's not supposed to be a romance! vgnmklasdnmcfklasdnmlckasm exclamation points!
But it is supposed to be a tragedy
Yes. And it's very tragic. And not just because Romeo and Juliet die in the end.
I was more responding to the people saying it's not romantic. That's like saying Schindler's List is not very romantic. Cause it's not supposed to be. I can't really comment on the quality of writing (though keep in mind it's a play, not a novel) or the balance between comedy and tragedy. It's been around 15 years since I last read it.
Yabbut, a lot of people seem to be under the delusion that R&J is a romance -- some kind of romantic ideal of young love, when it's absolutely nothing of the kind. Same goes for Twilight.
Authorial intent be damned, on that last.
That's definitely true. But, it seems like in Ithica's case, at least, they're saying they don't like it cause it's a poorly written romance. So if someone is basing their dislike of it on the idea that it's supposed to be some great romance, and then they're disappointed, well, revising your expectations may lead to liking it more. Or not. I'm not saying people have to like it. But saying that it's a bad story because it fails as a romance is completely misunderstanding it.
OHHH Shakespeare!! How I Loathe thee!!!!
What definition of romance are you using? I was curious so had a look round, and saw several web pages arguing it wasn't a romance, on on Wikipedia that it was the first time Romance was considered a worthy subject of a play (plus the only unifying theme is that of young love), but not much else either way.
That's an interesting question.
The last time I read Shakespeare's plays was when I was 15 or something (that's 20 years ago). And I only read the Finnish translations because my English wasn't good enough. (Meaning I probably shouldn't talk about them at all ) My impression about Romeo and Juliet was that there were two major themes: the family hatred between Montague and Capulet families and the "forbidden love" which caused the tragic deaths.
I always thought Romeo and Juliet's "love" (lust, maybe. Iirc they didn't know each other well enough to actually love each other in the sense of the word we use now) was more of a rebellion against the patriarchs of the families. I always saw them as teenagers who wanted to live their own lives, and because of bad luck it resulted in tragedy. But it's just a today's person's point of view. I don't know how the play was seen in Shakespeare's time.
I feel like there's more to a story being a romance than just the mere fact that the main characters have the hots for each other. There are definitely romantic tragedies (just as there are romantic comedies), but I don't think that just because R&J had the hots for each other and the story follows their courtship means that the story is about their romantic relationship, or that the story is a romance.
To me, the story is more about the stupidity of nobility, the absurdity of notions such as love at first sight, the hypocrisy of the church, and ultimately, the tragedy that those factors brought about.
It's a tough distinction to make, for a couple reasons. I think most other genres have some sort of definitive thing you can usually point to that makes a book fit in to that genre. A book with magic is fantasy (it may also be other things, but it is definitely fantasy). A book with space travel that's set in the future is speculative fiction (AKA science fiction). But, say, a book where everyone dies in the end isn't necessarily a tragedy. There's more to a tragedy than simply bad things happening. I feel the same thing is true of a romance. But, the other reason it's tough distinction for me to make is that I'm not particularly familiar with the romance genre, so maybe R&J actually is in line with what people are calling romances these days. *shrug*
Anyway, the story very definitely is about things like love (real or not), sex, and relationships. These things are obviously closely related to romance. I'm by no means a literary scholar, and I obviously don't know what Shakespeare was thinking when he wrote the play. But when I read the book (and when I think about it now) I do not think of it as a book about the romantic relationship between Romeo and Juliette (I actually think it's rather questionable that they even had such a thing, despite what they themselves believed).
But yeah. It's perhaps not so much the label itself (of romance) that bothers me, but the dismissive attitude that label causes, instead. Maybe it's more accurate for me say it's not merely a romance. The romantic relationship between R&J is the least that story has to offer.
Strangely when u read Arthurian Legend they call them "Romances"..So whats up with that!!?? LOL
Separate names with a comma.