Discussion in 'Wheel of Time Discussion - Books 1-14' started by dragon's left hand, Jan 26, 2013.
I'm the same way about Faile.
Good quote! -steals-
I think, perhaps, Aviendha is best for Rand. She pushes him, but in a good way. She teaches him about the Aiel, because it's what he needed. She helps him because it's the right thing to do. When she also ends up loving him, it's a bonus.
I also dislike Faile. When I was about 16 my sister told me (before learning about my vehement dislike of the woman) that I was "just like" Faile and it floored me so thoroughly that I couldn't speak coherently for a few minutes. With Faile, though, I mainly dislike her because of her complete disregard for Perrin's feelings, culture, and tendencies. She knows that he is kind and gentle and was raised totally differently from her, but still belittles him for not shouting at her like her father would at her mother, and expects him to essentially, be able to read her mind to learn about her mood. However, that's off-topic.
Speechless for being called Faile. I wish I could've seen that. Has she used it on you again?
On the subject of Elayne, I love her I like how she raises her chin when someone upsets her, how she uses her smile to get her way, that she tries to listen-in and use swear words she's heard but doesn't understand what they mean. When I read about her acting up, I just think I'd kiss it out of her instead of slapping or spanking her. I have always enjoyed a challenge though. Maybe she's as much of a challenge to Rand as Avi is.
Well the reason it floored me so thoroughly was that I thought she was insulting me in the most cruel possible way lol) and couldn't figure out why she was doing so, since we had just spent a lovely half hour or so chatting about WoT and where she was in the books. Then she said that I was just like Faile and it was the insult was so out of the blue, that I'm afraid I sputtered for quite awhile before making my thoughts on that comparison abundantly clear. And no, she's never used that one on me again.
You can have Elayne, Arecias. I certainly wouldn't want to deal with her. Even if I don't dislike her quite as much as I used to, she still irritates me. But not as much as Faile does.
I'm still laughing trying to imagine that scene. I don't think I've ever been so insulted it made me speechless. And for being compared to Faile
My daughter and I were making bookmarks one day, and I printed a drawing of Elayne from deviantart that I made into a bookmark. She has her chin raised in the drawing
Yeah, she was just going to leave it at the first letter but Nynaeve said you have to be firm with your man sometimes, which for Lan she DOES, but Elayne being a silly child with no experience took it as she had to yell at Rand to keep him under control Chalk that up to her taking Nynaeve's advice wrong
I liked Elayne for Rand at first, but I'm leaning more towards Avi now. I'm not a huge fan of Min to be honest...
Also, Faile, I AGREE. Mari Sedai said it right, she knew what kind of man she was marrying but she was like those stupid girls that are all like "I can CHANGE HIM!!!" *shakes head* She just gets on my nerves.
Of the girls in WoT I'd be closest to Nynaeve
I'm glad to see I'm not the only one who can't stand Faile (apt name too). I actually googed "Faile irritating" to find out if I was the only one who felt that way. I have more thoughts on that...but I'm not going to hijack the thread.
Off topic from the main purpose of this thread, but I have to chime in ...
I think I am the only person who actually really likes Faile, and I'm ok with that. She has her flaws and she can be irritating quite often, but I still really do like her. And I love her and Perrin together.
Well, Rand himself says he doesn't love either of them "a hair more or less" than the others, and he says it in front of Moiraine and Nynaeve. Nyn of course boxed his ears, but he stood his ground.
I do think he SHOWS this love publicly to Min most, though, because she goes with him everywhere. (People are used to seeing them together, and they share a room at night, too, so most even consider them already married.) Elayne and Avi have their own things going on, so he can't swoon over them like Min. It did surprise me though when *SPOILER ALERT*
Elayne said in the meeting of the Dragon's Peace something along the lines of "I do love you Rand, but I'm not sure about this plan." She admitted her love to him to ALL the reigning Kings/Queens/Lords/Ladies that were there! Min and Avi had both publicly mentioned their relationship with Rand, but Elayne was keeping it quiet for the babes. It was after this that Elayne told her Andorans that she was carrying the DR's babes.
I agree about both Min and Elayne. Min has always bothered me, and that is totally why! Just be your own woman in your own way and be with a man at the same time, FFS. It's okay to be your own self! Elayne and Avi have both shown they can do this, by loving him while being busy with responsibility. Min has no responsibility though, outside researching for Rand because he's too busy, which anyone else with half a brain could've done. (Which is why I think it *may* be hard for her to leave the Seanchan as they gave her a purpose in life. But, I moreso see her being so wool-headed and feeling so empty without him around that she will leave her purpose to go find him.)
While I do believe like someone else mentioned above, each girl is good for him in their own way, I do believe Avi and he have the best foundation. Min saw that she would fall in love with him, so it was a self-fulfilling prophecy- I can't believe she loved him from her own will as she SAW she would, and then accepted it, kinda missing the whole process of falling in love with him. (I hope that made sense?) Though yes, I do agree she does love him, she just lost herself in him, which I think is really sad. Elayne and he did the whole flirting/stealing kisses/being teenagers thing, so I feel like they were trying to take advantage of fun and love before their responsibilities took them away from each other; a kind of puppy love, if you will. He and Avi started off where she viewed him almost like a nemesis, lolz. He had to EARN her love, which neither Elayne nor Min made him do. So I think Avi really taught him what it's like to respect a relationship, even to earn the relationship...and waited to be with him intimately again until she was a Wise One, teaching him that equality in relationships is a GOOD thing. I think her love is the deepest, purist love because she had to transform it from hate (she said herself in TSR that she would hate him forever) to the kind of love she has now. The bridal wreath kind!
I honestly think it's down to Avi though WHO he marries, if any of them do marry in the future. If she lays a bridal wreath at his feet for herself and Elayne as her FS, and he accepts it, then Min would have to go to Avi in order to ever lay down a bridal wreath to him. Unless of course, Min goes and finds him first, and they get married, which I think Rand knows would piss Avi off too much. I don't think that is a risk he wants to take, so I guess it's good that in ToM Avi says she is sure her and Min can come to a compromise in regards to Rand, lolz.
I think he loves Min most. Min has been always honest to him. She never leaves him. She sees his trueself not the Dragon or Caracarn.
You guys said that Min does not have a life outside of Rand. Well she aint rich, highborn and she ain't gonna be queen of someplace. She ain't an Aiel. She aint gonna be Wise One. She sees things around people. Things that will happen in the future. She has to be stick with Rand. She can be effective that way.
Personally, I read this as "because Min didn't have a station in life the way Elayne and Avi did, she is less of an independent woman than the other two." Cause I mean really, it's not exactly Min's fault that she doesn't have a country to run, or can't become a member of the elite ruling council of an entire people. She can't channel, doesn't have her own business or own any land. All she has is her intelligence and her unique talent, both of which she's put at the disposal of the man who is going to save the world, who also happens to be the man she loves.
You say she has no responsibility "outside of researching." A) What, exactly, do you want her to be responsible for, and B) why do you think the research she's doing is useless or could be done by anyone else? Her research was of a very sensitive nature and I doubt there are very many other people Rand would have trusted it to, and all of those other people had other jobs already. Is it so bad to be the one to fill a necessary position?
Not to mention, her research was the reason Rand was able to defeat Morridin.
I habent even finuished the series so I really shouldn't be here,... BUT I cant resist. ALL I can say is he BETTER love MIN best.. Because she is FRANKLY the best
Honestly Min isn't my fave but El is right, she could have been an average bimbo who's only role was to sit there and sleep with Rand, but she took it upon HERSELF to do all that research. She didn't have a duty fall in her lap like the others, she gave herself one. And I think that makes her a lot better than useless
well that why I would love her most if I were him. EVEN if she did just sit around and look pretty. I mean MIN loved him BEFORE he was anything more than a farmboy...When the other women talk about him or even THINK about them they speak harshly and seem much more "devious" if u will. MIN seems to REALLY REALLY care about him as a simple man. She seems to be the one that most often forgets hes the Dragon, and just sees the man she loves.
I mean sometimes u don't need a person to be anything except supportive and loving to make a HUGE difference. THATS MIN!! Supportive and Loving...
I had never considered this before, but I do find it interesting that an overwhelming majority say Min. I would have to agree. Elayne has the interests of the Tower (and Caemlyn)to look forward to in addition to his, as Aviendha has the Aiel. Min has no allegiance apart from Rand. Knowing this allows Rand to keep her close to him, and so she gets to share more of his time than the others. Also, he learned a great deal from Elayne and Aviendha, from the running of nations to the workings of the Aiel clans and way of life. Min did not have the same to teach him because her way of life and background are not so different from his. She thinks more on his level. Certainly sounds like more of a wife for him than the other two.
I am not sure it is Min not having a station in life - but her only responsibility is to Rand - and therefore protecting the man she loves the only way she can - learning how to help him by reading about his enemies and their flaws or ways to defeat their abilities. Her best assets are her presence with him and her mind. Elayne seems to not use her mind enough even tough she is smart, and Avi seems to hesitant by honor code. They both could have been much more help to him.
I don't ow if he loves one best - he just loves them all differently, the way i love my kids differently for different reasons. I don't love one better though.
I think Min and Rand were the perfect couple. They connect with each other the best. They're growth in education and interests mirror each other. They both start as commoners, then gain positions of prestige. They always communicate at the same level, with very little confusion and misunderstandings.
Rand loves all his wives for different reasons. I think that he loves them equally. Some people mention that he spends most of his time wih Min. He is not spending time with her because he loves her more but because she needs him more. Elayne and Avi are leaders of their nations. They cannot aford to follow along with Rand even thoughh ey want to. Min can travel with Rand and wants to travel with him so she does.
Separate names with a comma.