Knife of Dreams re-readalong: To the End!

Discussion in 'Wheel of Time Discussion - Books 1-14' started by Rhed al'Tere, Oct 3, 2016.

  1. Ryu Shadowborn

    Ryu Shadowborn Resident Citizen

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    Re: Knife of Dreams re-readalong: Chapters 19-23

    19 – Ogier wedding, which backfires horribly on Loial's Mother. That is what we call REKT!

    [​IMG]

    And then Trollocs show up, which proves that weddings are always the worst thing, they always end badly like in Invasions by the dark armies.

    20 – This chapter, 11 Books ago we heard that if Lan were to raise the Golden Crane that all of the borderlands would be behind him, and it starts to pay off finally and god it is awesomeness. Every moment with Lan from here on out is just epic.
     
  2. Rhed al'Tere

    Rhed al'Tere Aes Sedai

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    Re: Knife of Dreams re-readalong: Chapters 24-27

    I was cheering for Erith. ^^

    And I agree, this is the book where things are getting wrapped up and we move on with the story past these roadblocks. That's why I couldn't put it down and finished it. :lol
     
  3. Ryu Shadowborn

    Ryu Shadowborn Resident Citizen

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    Re: Knife of Dreams re-readalong: Chapters 24-27

    21 - I find it really hard to buy into the whole "Dark one is making all food spoil and everyone everywhere is starving" thing, it gets really grating as the series goes on especially in the last book where the implication is that every town everywhere including the 4 rivers has been emptied out and everyone is about to starve. Because in the end of the series after the Dark One is beaten if starvation is this bad then everybody is dead anyways.

    22 - I find it really hard to care about the Amayar or the Seafolk deal with them. We never hear of them before The Cleansing of the Taint, and the seafolk tend to be so grating that them going drama queen about them dying feels so empty when they go drama queen about almost every little thing.

    23 - There finally, the Aes Sedai know the taint has been cleansed. Why did Rand not have someone announce that in all of his holdings, or have someone scream that from the mountain tops is far beyond me.

    24 - Consider how many browns or yellows had to test this forkroot stuff on themselves and each other to find out how much it takes to lessen ability in the one power without putting them asleep, and I wonder if Elaida ordered that to be done as a plan for when Egwene got back in the tower.
     
  4. Aduiavas Ida

    Aduiavas Ida Aes Sedai Mistress of Revels - Europe Forum Moderator

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    Re: Knife of Dreams re-readalong: Chapters 24-27

    I LOVE Egwene in this chapter ^^ She can be annoying at times, especially before she becomes Amyrlin. But in this situation her stubbornness and quality comes through in full. It does of course help that the Tower is all but crumbling, but it is still impressive...
     
  5. Ryu Shadowborn

    Ryu Shadowborn Resident Citizen

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    Re: Knife of Dreams re-readalong: Chapters 28-33

    KOD - 25: The Reds really lose steam on the whole "Bonding Asha'man" stuff when the Rebels have already voted to do so.

    Mat is so freaked out by the concept of kissing Tuon that he holds back and gets told to man up, and come on guys! You have Mat Cauthon, have him lead you through the passes randomly. His luck will guide you through. Big Picture folks!

    KOD - 26 : Tuon really needs to stop assuming everything the wetlanders talk about is superstition, especially when they are provably true. -cough- like Trollocs..or Taver'en

    KOD - 27: Rand - I find Semhirage's claims here to be fairly suspect. How would she know what the taint does? She was sealed through the breaking how would she know of the effects of the taint. It is not like she has had much time to really study the long term effects of a male tainted by the power in the few months to years she was freed from the seal.

    Mat - Whelp Mat not only creates Canon's he invents Guerrilla warfare.

    KOD - 28 : Faile at least tries to save herself here, it really isn't her fault that she doesn't think that Galina is not on the level here, and she does everything she can right up to using Morgaise's small ability with the power to do what she can.

    KOD - 29: So Tam wasn't with Perrin through all of this? I guess it explains some however why would Tam not go with Perrin when the Two Rivers folks head off to see Rand?
     
    Last edited: Nov 26, 2016
  6. Aduiavas Ida

    Aduiavas Ida Aes Sedai Mistress of Revels - Europe Forum Moderator

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    Re: Knife of Dreams re-readalong: Chapters 28-33

    I just have to say:

    FINALLY DONE WITH MALDEN AND THE SHAIDO!!! :joy

    That whole plotline irritates me... It takes way to long to resolve, and I dislike Faile in this situation. She is not my favourite character by a mile, but here she is so totally helpless and it bugs me. Also, Morgase :(
    But seriously, I don't think I would have been half as annoyed if it had been a man captured by the Shaido. But this is classic damsel-in-distress, and I don't like it. I especially dislike having to read the sections with Rolan :| He is portrayed as a sort of good guy, and maybe he is better than the Shaido around him, but he is still bloody creepy. He may not physically abuse Faile, but he makes constant threats, and are close to blackmailing her. I am so glad that Perrin killed him, and lucky for him, BEFORE he knew the circumstances...
     
  7. Aduiavas Ida

    Aduiavas Ida Aes Sedai Mistress of Revels - Europe Forum Moderator

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    Re: Knife of Dreams re-readalong: Chapters 28-33

    Also, I always wondered why on earth Galina didn't free herself of the oaths the moment she got a hold of that rod, but now, while listening to the audiobook it dawned on me... She has to get permission to channel. So she needs someone else to channel into the rod for her.. :facepalm

    I am however, not at all sorry for her fate :|
     
  8. Ryu Shadowborn

    Ryu Shadowborn Resident Citizen

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    She is somewhat helpless here but she does attempt to actively escape with her own plans, and I think it was good to see her fail. She has generally been shown as "Super Smart Spy lady who is always right when it comes to political intrigue" from book 4 on so having her actually fail on something is good for her character, the plot just went on way to long.

    I would have been, simply because the "captured by Shaido" plot doesn't really add anything or resolve any plotlines. The Shaido still exist in large numbers after this, Perrin's wolf side doesn't get advanced, and the Seanchan really don't go anywhere, heck Galina being black Ajah doesn't matter either because Egwene. It is just lots of Filler meant to keep Perrin occupied since his major conflict is largely internal and we can't have the main 3 resolve their issues until right before the climax.

    KOD - 30 And here goes two plots that meant absolutely nothing.

    KOD - 31 Elayne gets herself in trouble again, by assuming she is smarter than her opponents.

    KOD - 32 What in the name of the Light are the seafolk thinking here? "Don't want to get involved in your war." Elayne being captured by the Black Ajah has NOTHING TO DO WITH THAT. As far as I am concerned Chanelle is a dark friend.
     
  9. Kassina Tendar

    Kassina Tendar Aes Sedai

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    I'm actually the opposite. :lol Faile annoys me sooo much when she's with Perrin. She's so petty and just expects him to understand how Saldaean relationships work when there's no reason he would possibly know that. :| Not to mention her endangering the lives of everyone in the Ways many books ago out of spite. :| (poor Loial having to put up with it...)

    Conversely, while the Malden plotline can get old, I quite like Faile when she's by herself! :look Sure, she doesn't totally end up rescuing herself, but she has multiple rescue plans in the works and does a remarkable job at keeping her group together throughout their capture.

    Basically I only like Faile when she's not around Perrin. :lol She drives me crazy otherwise.
     
  10. Megana Vallentin

    Megana Vallentin Aes Sedai

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    I always get invested in the Malden plot as the end approaches. I love that Morgase has to channel to save them, such a rare and difficult thing for her, and even though I really seriously dislike events between Rolan and Faile, I was super sad about Rolan's death. By Aiel standards, he wasn't doing anything wrong by pursuing Faile and the way he and his friends were helping her could have gotten him in a lot of trouble.

    The stuff with Matt/Tuon always catches me completely off guard. I tend to only halfway pay attention to that plot at this point, so the first time I read the book I had to backtrack and re-read a few chapters to figure out how they met up with the Band and what led to Tuon finally saying the words. :lol
     
  11. Ryu Shadowborn

    Ryu Shadowborn Resident Citizen

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    So random thought time.

    In book 4 we find out that part of the Two River's marriage traditions is "The two must be engaged for a year" now Two Rivers is almost as close to an "Age of legends" style government as can be with 3 thousand years of separation between current day Westland and The AOL. What if the whole Gai'shain thing isn't just a throwback to the way of the leaf but a throwback to the courting ceremonies of the AOL as well? we hear before the fight in Malden that Gai'shain between two different genders tend to end with a wedding wreath placed.
     
  12. Rhed al'Tere

    Rhed al'Tere Aes Sedai

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    So many plot lines were tied up in this book, and things started rolling toward the Last Battle.

    Faile and the Shaido and Perrin and Malden.
    Sevanna. (She's captured by the Seanchan, right?)
    Mat and Tuon are finally married.
    Loial and Erith are finally married.
    The remaining Shaido head back to the Wastelands (right?).

    Egwene is still in the Tower, but is starting to take it over from the inside, through discussion with other Aes Sedai and by example. Leane is still imprisoned in the Tower as well.
    Nynaeve drops Lan at the ends of the earth and sets people riding for the Golden Crane and Tarmon Gaidon.

    Rand loses his hand and captures Semirhage. His reaction to losing the hand is the important part, in that he doesn't grieve it or miss it, but simply moves on. Part of the reason Cadsuane's task is so important (making him laugh and cry).
     
  13. Aduiavas Ida

    Aduiavas Ida Aes Sedai Mistress of Revels - Europe Forum Moderator

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    Not to mention that the Elayne-gains-the-throne plotline is also finally done :look
     
  14. Rhed al'Tere

    Rhed al'Tere Aes Sedai

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    Oh yeah! Fiiiiinally.

    Of course, she's still pregnant. :rolleyes But! At least she gets to eat normal food again.
     
  15. Wil Cambrae

    Wil Cambrae Sparkle Chief Gaidin

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    I was late back from lunch today at work, but I still got shivers when I read this bit.

     
  16. Imzadi Hopewind

    Imzadi Hopewind Aes Sedai

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    Gah, I'm too busy, so I have to stop reading, I am halfway thru this book, but will catch up once I'm "free" of everything else :shifty
     
  17. Ryu Shadowborn

    Ryu Shadowborn Resident Citizen

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    KOD - 33 : Woo! Siege of Camelyn is over, Pincer attacks can be quite effective as I well know

    KOD - 34 : Karade is a smart guy, he sees right through Mat's plan, but doesn't tell his compatriots.

    KOD - 35 : Elayne is now the official queen yay I guess. This plot did drag on far too long in many ways.

    KOD - 36 : Poor Mat, you can just feel his sense of doom as Tuon says the words. I wish we have had more of what goes on after the Last Battle, I want to know how Mat handles the Seanchan.

    KOD - 37 : Woo! Band of the Red Hand action!

    KOD - Epilogue : Whoo! Pevara is at the tower..because going into the tower at this time is a great idea? Right? No..not really...
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2016
  18. Kassina Tendar

    Kassina Tendar Aes Sedai

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    Chapter 1:
    -Poor Chesa. She’s so sad about Egwene. :(
    -Siuan really does believe Min’s Viewing about her and Gareth and is determined to stay close to him. :( I hate knowing what’s coming.
    -Lelaine tries to scoop up Siuan as soon as Egwene disappears :rolleyes Trying to reignite their old friendship

    Chapter 2:
    -I still think it’s really interesting that cats are drawn to Aes Sedai so much.
    -Beonin realizes how full the Tower would be if they didn’t have such arbitrary restrictions on who could enter the Tower, though she doesn’t like the idea of changing things herself
    -Beonin tries to not worry the Novices and Accepted by not telling them how Anaiya and Kairen had died. I can see why she’d want to do that, but it also doesn’t really help figure out who did it.
    -Beonin tries to find connections between Aniya and Kairen and settles on their connection to Rand and Moiraine through the Blue Ajah… good guess at least. :\
    -The White Tower really are ingrained in their ways and even admonish Novices and Accepted to not explore new things or seek answers to questions that no one can answer… which helped put them into the position they’re in today. :\
    -Kidnapping kings (even if supposedly for their own good) does not do a very good job at giving the people a good impression of the Tower… which is important given how far the Tower has fallen in power. Poor Mattin Stepaneos…
    -Elaida’s removing any evidence that the Blue Ajah ever existed. :rolleyes
    -Elaida wants Tarna to be more overtly proud of the Red Ajah and is annoyed that her stole is so thin… when she’s supposed to be the one who has abandoned her old Ajah. :|
    -As much as we’re supposed to hate Elaida and as much as she damages the Tower in her time as Amyrlin, she really does believe that the rebels are part of the Tower and wants to make it whole again.
    -Elaida doesn’t appreciate the intelligence Beonin can give her about the rebels and is just pissed that she’s ‘failed’.
    -It’s weird seeing how ‘normal’ Aes Sedai react to things like Dreaming and Dream ter’angreal, since they’ve become so normal to us!
    -…gah, Elaida’s so frustrating. :desk Refusing to believe even the possibility that the Seanchan are coming. She just learned about Dreaming, something she previously believed was impossible! Why is it so crazy to believe that Traveling’s possible, too? And she selfishly keeps any new discoveries to herself.

    Chapter 3:
    -Aran’gar thinks she’s the only one fit to rule in this age, since she specialized in primitive cultures in the Age of Legends.
    -Aran’gar realizes that Moridin has cour’souvra for both Moghedien and Cyndane
    -No one thinks that Cyndane is Lanfear since Cyndane is so much weaker in the power. It certainly make it an effective disguise, even though people keep thinking Cyndane seems rather similar to Lanfear.
    -Moridin shows the Forsaken images of Mat and Perrin and apparently not all of them had known what they’d looked like before… which probably good for Mat and Perrin’s sakes.

    Chapter 4:
    -Masema doesn’t trust the Seanchan, but is willing to work with them just to be close to Perrin
    -Aram’s started spending time with Masema and again Perrin decides to do nothing about it, though, and he still believes in Aram’s dedication to Faile.
    -Tylee recognizes Perrin from the Seanchan prophecies and tells him so
    -Perrin signs over his claim to Manetheren in exchange for Seanchan help-a claim he never intended to carry through with, so it’s a pretty good deal for him... Though of course, not all the Two Rivers men are happy with it.
    -Forkroot affects male channelers, too
    -Perrin has a letter from Suroth pretty much granting him permission to do anything… That certainly works out. Yay for ta’veren work! :lol
    -Perrin can barely stomach working with the Seanchan.

    Chapter 5:
    -Faile can translate nar’baha as ‘box of fools’ :lol
    -Bendhuin has gone to Rhuidean to possibly become the new Shaido Clan Chief, something Sevanna’s been trying to avoid.
    -Sevanna uses Maidens to guard her tent, which she shouldn’t do since she was never a Maiden
    -The Shaido camp strays farther from a typical Aiel camp and gai’shain women are in constant danger, unless they have a Mera’din to protect them.

    Chapter 6:
    -Noal likes to tell Olver about Shara, but no one believes he’s telling the truth.
    -Mat starts calling Tuon ‘Precious’ to try to gain some ground (I can’t say I blame him…) and Tuon sees it as a game to see who will break first.
    -Mat asks Noal if he’s related to Jain Farstrider. And Noal’s freaked out that he hasn’t been more circumspect, then tells us about himself in 3[SUP]rd[/SUP] person
    -Mat makes sure Olver has plenty of books to read. :)

    Chapter 7:
    -Mat tries to ignore Egeanin’s insistence that her name is Leilwin now
    -Mat’s very lucky that he got the horse for Tuon right before Seanchan invaded it and would surely have taken such a nice horse for themselves.
    -Altarans in the Seanchan army mark their armor differently. Why? Just out of pride for being the first place conquered by the Seanchan?
    -Joline, Teslyn, and Edesina are curious about Setalle Anan’s connection to the Tower… she really doesn’t do a good job at hiding it, especially around Aes Sedai.
    -Finally one of the sul'dam channels! :joy
     
    Last edited: Dec 4, 2016
  19. Ryu Shadowborn

    Ryu Shadowborn Resident Citizen

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    There is only one solution to this, we need an Orange Ajah and Ajah dedicated to MAD SCIENCE! (As far as Magic can be SCIENCED! at least, yes it is magic however that does not mean that you can not apply the Scientific Method to it.)
     
  20. Aduiavas Ida

    Aduiavas Ida Aes Sedai Mistress of Revels - Europe Forum Moderator

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    In a way, it makes sense that they wouldn't want the novices and Accepted to experiment, because, well, it can be dangerous ;) However, that does not mean that the AES SEDAI should not experiment more...